gunner Posted September 19, 2016 Report Share Posted September 19, 2016 Hi all just wondering what barrel life is like as thinking on this as next but build after 1 other . Would probably be using 160-180 grain bullets and RL 17 , seems to be a good powder choice - thanks for any info . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorset Winmag Posted September 19, 2016 Report Share Posted September 19, 2016 Cant comment on a .284 but I recently bore scoped a .243 which had seen 1200 rounds.... One word... Shredded!!! Mind you ..it still shoots sub moa! I think its a case of shoot it until it falls off the cliff then rebarrel Remember...barrels are bad...they must be punished and thrown aside! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laurie Posted September 19, 2016 Report Share Posted September 19, 2016 The usual answer is 'around 2,000 rounds'. But see response #6 on this Accurate Shooter Forum thread http://forum.accurateshooter.com/threads/284-win-barrel-life.3766801/ showing how variable this can be. However .... if you want velocity, load the cartridge with RS60 / Re17, but divide that 2,000 rounds life by at least two if you load up to the powder's full potential. With moderate pressure loads (180 at around 2,800-2,830 fps from 30-inches) and use of cool burning Viht N165, round counts well above 2,500 are likely before grouping falls off. There is lots of discussion on Accurate Shooter and other US forums on this very subject. Note though that American and Australian (as per the above response by 'cr500' on Accurate Shooter) who shoot American / Aussie F-Class do so in rather higher temperatures than ours and more importantly 'string shoot'. The latter sees the competitor get them off down range as fast as the targets are marked while wind conditions hold and a long, rapid string is a real 'barrel killer'. Similarly, Americans have trouble believing our guys' reported barrel life for the 7mm short magnums as we get nearly double what they do, but this is a result of lower ambient temperatures, shooting 'two on the mound' and a bit of sensible load / pressure management. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris-NZ Posted September 20, 2016 Report Share Posted September 20, 2016 One thing's for sure- "going for it" with RL17 or VV560 will not be good for a barrel. Ya get nuthin' for nuthin' there.. Our electronic targets aren't good on barrels with my 6x47L showing obvious throat wear at ~400rnds. I often get all 10 counters off in under 3mins in stable conditions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunner Posted September 21, 2016 Author Report Share Posted September 21, 2016 Thankyou for info , a chap pm me with info on it and was having good results from n165 i think he said , 2k from a barrel seems pretty reasonable . Atb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swarovski1 Posted September 21, 2016 Report Share Posted September 21, 2016 If you shoot the mcqueens you fire 10 shots in about 45 seconds depending how fast marker put the targets up to the windows.ive tried some RS60 loads and all the against opinions on this powder is putting me off it.use h4350 instead.i loaded up some 123gr amaxs with the last of the varget I had as they shot real well.i think I will keep the RS60 for the 162gr amax hunting load Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ezmobile Posted September 22, 2016 Report Share Posted September 22, 2016 Hi gunner. I'm going to doing something very similar to yourself in a few weeks time. Laurie has also advised me on the use of Vit N165 for the .284 win, so thats good enough for me! What twist are you going to use for the 180's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swarovski1 Posted September 23, 2016 Report Share Posted September 23, 2016 Had the phone call this afternoon from Mr Mckillop. My 284 is ready to rock n roll. Thank you very much ???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montey Posted September 24, 2016 Report Share Posted September 24, 2016 As a side note I've just been told Rel17 won't be available any more due to its EU lience running out this from a main stockist in Kent I do have an un opened can if any ones stuck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6mmBR Posted September 25, 2016 Report Share Posted September 25, 2016 RS60 is identical to Rel 17 Both are produced by Nitrochemie. RS60 is readily available in this country and will continue to do so. I suspect the reason is more to do with sales of RS60 has killed the market for Rel 17! Why pay £45 per lb of Rel 17 when you can have a kg of the same stuff in RS60 guise for £74! Cheers Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swarovski1 Posted September 26, 2016 Report Share Posted September 26, 2016 I asked about aftet I read the rel 17 bit and echoed what 6mm br has said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTO Posted September 26, 2016 Report Share Posted September 26, 2016 Had the phone call this afternoon from Mr Mckillop. My 284 is ready to rock n roll. Thank you very much How long since you ordered it? Fingers crossed he will do mine next. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swarovski1 Posted September 26, 2016 Report Share Posted September 26, 2016 6 weeks ish.i cant remember exactly but somewhere near that.was at proof for 2 weeks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunner Posted October 2, 2016 Author Report Share Posted October 2, 2016 Hi gunner. I'm going to doing something very similar to yourself in a few weeks time. Laurie has also advised me on the use of Vit N165 for the .284 win, so thats good enough for me! What twist are you going to use for the 180's? Speaking with Artiglio hes running a 9 twist , but as he says sierra 183 and berger 195s would definitely need an 8 . But still early days yet . As swaro thats why i switched smith as its done in the blink of an eye ! who wants to wait a year or more ! i heard one chaps been waiting 4 years and fully paid . OMG anyway this is a nice caliber so am sure thisl be the one .ATB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick 53 Posted December 10, 2016 Report Share Posted December 10, 2016 Hi all, I shoot 6-5/284 . Necked to 7mm. I use Viht 165 great powder. Using Scenar L 180 I am currently using 55 gn paper puncher F Class open. 1-9 30" heavy profile barrel. Great rifle, had some great info from Laurie and Vince who are true inspirations for help and success. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swarovski1 Posted December 11, 2016 Report Share Posted December 11, 2016 My 284 has a 26 inch tube and ive been testing 180gr scenar l's with N165.with 56.5grs the scenar is doing 2830 fps.my must be fairly close to max at that.going to try a few at 1000yds today.if you try them with RS60 past 51grs keep your eye out for pressure signs.51grs gave 2888fps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick 53 Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 Since my last visit to the range, my loads for my 7mm have to be reduced from Viht 165 55grs down to 53grn. My primers are still cratering and still have extractor marks on the brass. My MV using 55grs was 2802. Will write again on results of 53 grs in the New Year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ezmobile Posted January 15, 2017 Report Share Posted January 15, 2017 Have a look at using RS62. I've been checking out the numbers on "Quickload" and, unless I'm missing something, they look quite favorable. It runs a little bit hotter than Vit N165, but better than RS60. Also, the pressures look fairly good too, even slightly lower than N165! I haven't tried it yet, but has anyone had any experience with it, I'd like to hear if you have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Haze Posted January 16, 2017 Report Share Posted January 16, 2017 I have been doing the same little investigation in the last few weeks. I shoot a .284" Win with 32" barrel in an F Class rig. I am aiming for around 2850-2880 fps with a Berger 180 H fo balance performance and brass life. I have found almost exactly these numbers with both 51.5 gr of RS60 and 55.0 Gr of RS70. Quick load would indicate that RS70 is working at around 15% less max pressure than RS60. Performance/accuracy was the same with both. I think I will stick with RS70 to see how it goes... The only downside I can see is that I need to use a bit more powder, but everything else would seem better - better case fill volume, lower pressure and therefore a better safety margin on hot loads. And mabey the ability to push harder without ruining the brass? I'd be interested to hear the thoughts of some of the wise reloading heads like Laurie on that one - as unless I am missing something, I really cannot figure out why RS60 seems to be the 'go to' powder on the .284 for the heavies over RS70. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
20series Posted January 17, 2017 Report Share Posted January 17, 2017 I'm using 180 Berger Hybrid with 55gns H4831sc. I get 2850fps out of a 32inch Bartlein 1/9 twist. Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laurie Posted January 17, 2017 Report Share Posted January 17, 2017 - as unless I am missing something, I really cannot figure out why RS60 seems to be the 'go to' powder on the .284 for the heavies over RS70. RS60 often gives outstanding results with minimal load development required. Sometimes though, it suddenly 'stops performing' for no discernable reason and no amount of retuning gets the user back to where he started. It definitely reduces barrel life too, the amount depending on how hot the load is. The Americans have largely abandoned the powder now (in its Alliant Re17 guise) for the 284 in F-Class, largely on barrel life concerns, but also as it is now regarded as being very temperature affected. I ran your RS60 v RS70 loads through QuickLOAD and got different results from yours - 2,900 fps and 58,725 psi for RS60 and an extra 64 fps and 62,270 psi for RS70. Even reducing the RS70 charge weight to give identical MVs for the pair only saw a modest PMax reduction benefit through using the slower powder, now reduced to 56,909 psi or 1,816 psi down on the RS60 projected value. RS70's specific energy rating is a little lower than that of RS60 - 3,950 v 3,990 Kj/Kg, a 1% reduction. Against that, you stick more powder in the case, 6.8% more at 55gn v 51.5gn, so overall the energy input is increased, QuickLOAD also saying it is a marginally less efficient combination thermodynamically ~34% reduced by 1%. As that heat input is still there and isn't working on the bullet, it is spent on other things, one of which is heating the barrel. (Not that a 1% change will make a discernable difference, rather to point out that use of a slower burning powder doesn't in itself guarantee better outcomes.) The £700 (rebarreling cost) question is: Does a reduced peak pressure loading with a hotter burning high-energy propellant erode the throat area faster / the same rate / slower than a same MV / higher pressure loading with a single-based powder? I've no answer to that and never seen anybody else give one to date. As a rule, I simply try to avoid double-based / high-energy powders if I can. Against that, I have seen 308 FTR shooters with high MV loadings for heavy bullets over Viht N550 achieve good barrel life, and others with full pressure N150 loadings get not very good life. So ........ ? (I suspect, chambers and barrel steels have a large part to play in this, so it is very difficult to do an apples v apples comparison here between different people's experiences using different makes of barrel even in one calibre.) The other relevant factor in powder choice is that all other things being equal (which they usually won't be), the move to a slower burning powder may actually increase wear as it stretches out the period of peak heat / pressure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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