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How good are the 7mm 180gn Senars


dorg

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I am thinking of building another 7mm rifle for F class and throating it for senars rather than Bergers. Has anyone had good sucess with these over the Bergers. Is this a safe move?

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In my experience, I think (when pointed) they perform as well ballistically as the VLD's (unpointed), don't think they match the hybrids. I got pressure earlier/couldn't drive them as fast as the bergers with the same powder as either the vld's or hybrids but it wasn't a massive difference c. 20/30 fps dependant on powder used.

On the plus side you can get them and they're a lot cheaper. I'm just about to have my f class rifle rebarrelled and will have it throated for the scenar L's.

in any case I only ever put my 'mock up' round together by eye anyway so I'm sure it will shoot the bergers fine if I did want to switch back. My current barrel was throated for the hybrids originally.

 

cheers

 

Rich

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I've just started load development with the 180 at 100 in a 'straight' 284, and they seem very easy to tune. Using the Berger 180 VLD as a substitute to get in initial loads from QuickLOAD, first time out MVs were getting on 100 fps lower than expected using IMR-4831 and Viht N165, so it's a case of work another 1-2gn up on the next outing.

 

The meplats are huge by Berger standards, so pointing is a must for L-R use. Measuring and weighing them, they're extremely consistent out of the box.

 

The 150 version is not an L-R design, quite blunt and the quoted BC is very modest. I bought a few and it looks like I might get a good short-range combination for the 284 with N160 as they shoot very tight 3-round groups. If the performance holds up with 5-round strings, I'll give them a try at up to 600 yards and see how the elevations look.

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i was using 180 grn smk ,half way through a comp at bisley i switched after dropping them on the old load.noticed no difference good or bad.i did look at the meplats laurie but my thoughts were surely lapua know what they are doing ?? if pointing makes them better why would lapua make them like this with there rep at stake? keep me posted how you find them when pointed please laurie i'd be very interested.

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i was using 180 grn smk ,half way through a comp at bisley i switched after dropping them on the old load.noticed no difference good or bad.i did look at the meplats laurie but my thoughts were surely lapua know what they are doing ?? if pointing makes them better why would lapua make them like this with there rep at stake? keep me posted how you find them when pointed please laurie i'd be very interested.

 

 

The reason for retaining an opening at the front of the jacket = meplat is to provide a surface for the bullet ejection pin that runs through the top of the nose-forming die to have something to bear upon. (Look at cr+p FMJBT military bullets and you'll often see the point has been distorted or partially flattened through the pin hitting the point.)

 

It looks like an number of manufacturers had previously reduced meplat size a bit too much for the good of the bullet quality or the health of their dies. (A jammed or broken ejector pin sees a major production hold-up and may see a number of near finished bullets rejected.) Bryan Litz, Berger's ballistician / designer says the company increased its meplat diameter on the Hybrid nose-form dies for production reliablity and quality .... and also points out that their BC is therefore capable of a greater degree of improvement than older designs through pointing. (Since Bryan collaborated with John Whidden on the latter's pointing die insert designs, I think it's unlikely that he believes this is an unwise process!)

 

It's not just the Scenar Ls that have increased meplats it seems. I've not bought any 'standard' Scenars for a while, but an unhappy Diggle member moaned at me a week or two back that he'd mixed rounds loaded with old 6.5mm 123s with those using bullets from a newly purchased batch and the resulting rounds shot all over the place. When he inspected them, the new ones had noticeably wider meplats.

 

So, it's a quality control measure, but not one that's done for ballistic reasons. People can point bullets without worries that they're upsetting some inbuilt design feature. The important thing is to make sure you don't overdo it - if you do, you distort the jacket and bullet form. If in doubt, under rather than over-point any bullet.

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  • 4 weeks later...

Widden die is the way forwards trigger squeezer….

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Proudly manufactured in the UK - Bullet pointing system inserts for Redding Comp seating dies by Shooting Shed.

 

Dave manufactures the actual pointer die part for the specific bullet head that the buyer specifies or sends him. I have one that was originally ordered for 180grn .284 SMKs but so far it has worked with all other bullets between 168 and 180 grn.

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