wabbit evaporator Posted June 6, 2013 Report Share Posted June 6, 2013 I remember when HMRs first started to land on these shores. It was THE calibre all of a sudden, I bought one ( a Sako Quad) and still have it. I have shot a small number of foxes with it, maybe half a dozen, of those probably 5 went down lights out the last was a different matter....... Long story short we found that the bullet had hit the brow and failed. Fox had gone down as if brained but got up and gapped it as I was on my way to pick it up. Follow up shots ensued and we eventually retrieved it. Whilst I accept that 6 shots on foxes with the calibre is hardly a statistically viable sample size I don't know anyone who shoots a lot of foxes who uses HMR anymore. .22 centrefires and the other available calibres are just so much more authoritative. I've been out a couple of evenings in the last two weeks, the first evening with just the HMR rabbit bashing, had the opportunity on two foxes and I can honestly say that I let them go. Second evening I took the .243 as well. I don't blame any constabulary for not authorising the calibre on foxes- I wouldn't either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunner Posted June 6, 2013 Report Share Posted June 6, 2013 iv just read all the posts and im glad most people dont use it ! im running a HMR , got one as soon as they came out ! first fox killed instantly 130 yds in the heart-straight on! twas until my 2nd fox that at 80 yds led on a round straw bail shot between the eyes , got to the fox and it was still running around no more than 10-20yds away , i was fumbeling trying to turn the magnification down and wind the side focus to get a clear picture by the time id even done that it went in to cover never to be seen ! that was the last time ! i remember an outing also in the afternoon that i had the HMR - fox 70 yds away led sun bathing itself enjoying itself , i had the crosshair between the eyes , i couldnt do it ! and never will now after that fox on the bail ! my HMR is a rabbit and corvid gun with the odd squirell ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mount Hawke Sniper Posted June 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 6, 2013 iv just read all the posts and im glad most people dont use it ! im running a HMR , got one as soon as they came out ! first fox killed instantly 130 yds in the heart-straight on! twas until my 2nd fox that at 80 yds led on a round straw bail shot between the eyes , got to the fox and it was still running around no more than 10-20yds away , i was fumbeling trying to turn the magnification down and wind the side focus to get a clear picture by the time id even done that it went in to cover never to be seen ! that was the last time ! i remember an outing also in the afternoon that i had the HMR - fox 70 yds away led sun bathing itself enjoying itself , i had the crosshair between the eyes , i couldnt do it ! and never will now after that fox on the bail ! my HMR is a rabbit and corvid gun with the odd squirell ! I like the honesty people have used on hereI think the HMR if purchased will stick firmly to bunnies and other small vermin I already thought the HMR was not enough gun for a fox and most people have confirmed this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abolter Posted June 6, 2013 Report Share Posted June 6, 2013 I think there has been a lot of sense talked on here. First you will struggle to get it conditionned although I am not sure how the new guideline regarding AOLQ will affect this. Second, as with others I have seen adulkt foxes clear off pronto after the .17. What it is really good for is cubs and if you nhave a den of those o clear up then getting 6 small foxes can be a lot esaier than trying to get them later. Having said that they will be just as dead with the CFs for sure. To illustrate the point, I have a ,204 calibre and use 32grain bullets just now but I will be switching my NV set up onto my 22/250 and using 55grainers once we are onto stubbles as the bullets will behave better if there is an odd bit of wispy stuff unseen en route Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 I think there has been a lot of sense talked on here. First you will struggle to get it conditionned although I am not sure how the new guideline regarding AOLQ will affect this. Second, as with others I have seen adulkt foxes clear off pronto after the .17. What it is really good for is cubs and if you nhave a den of those o clear up then getting 6 small foxes can be a lot esaier than trying to get them later. Having said that they will be just as dead with the CFs for sure. To illustrate the point, I have a ,204 calibre and use 32grain bullets just now but I will be switching my NV set up onto my 22/250 and using 55grainers once we are onto stubbles as the bullets will behave better if there is an odd bit of wispy stuff unseen en route mmm, yet to find any bullet that didn't mis behave some fired through cover even 140 grn stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaz6br Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 mmm, yet to find any bullet that didn't mis behave some fired through cover even 140 grn stuff Im sure abolter isn't on about thick cover, more like the odd long length of rape stubble that might be sticking up in the way of mr fox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happyhunter Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 When I had a cz455 in hmr I bought it spur of the moment with all the hype and what a waste of money (was sold within the month) a few times out rabbiting I passed up on a fox or two around 120-130 yards as conditions wernt perfect for the hmr but a cf would of done the job (although it nailed a few 3/4 grown cubs over bait with nv around the 80yard mark with head shots) For a pure foxing rifle the round used should be capable of killing the fox cleanly from any angle which the hmr is defiantly no good for. The lad I sold it to used it for foxes twice and sold it on had a fox at about 100y (front chest shot) and the bullet just seemed to explode on impact and not penetrate, the follow up shot with the .22/250 after the fox ran across use about 170y at full tilt was very conclusive... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6.5shooter Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 I bought a sako quad hmr years ago and was never happy with the consistency of the accuracy. Shot plenty of rabbits and a few crows with it. Sold it and bought another quad this time in the heavy varmint version, had the dame accuracy inconsistency! Anyways, shot at a cub one night around 80 yards frontal chest shot and it didnt drop it! Followed a few spots of blood on the grass with the lamp and traced it further down the field. Never again! Sold it and if my 22lr isnt up to the task in hand then the 223 comes out! That was 4 years ago and have never looked back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 Im sure abolter isn't on about thick cover, more like the odd long length of rape stubble that might be sticking up in the way of mr fox Can't second guess anyone else personally, however it can be as little as this to destabilise a bullet. In my experience heavier bullets "punching through cover" is a total myth that sounds good and very feasible but don't bear up in practice. Test shooting through some grass and light foliage yourself onto paper it can be enlightening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveK Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 "punching through cover" A far cry from the "an odd bit of wispy stuff" that Abolter posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 A far cry from the "an odd bit of wispy stuff" that Abolter posted. I don't get you but I aint wasting my time with third parties and hearsay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alycidon Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 .22wmr 100yds. 178ft/lb 200. 118 ft/lb Bonus, you can get a wmr in semiauto, so can be used for a rapid follow up if needed. All the WMRs I have seen have not been that hot accuracy wise, a semi would be worse unless it has been breathed on. I now dont use my 17AH for foxes unless close let alone 17HMR. Never lost a hit fox with centerfires untill I used the 17AH, have now lost 2. A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montey Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 I use my 204 on fox both 32g and 40g do the business I have a 17hmr and its great on rabbits but I wouldn't use it on a fox If you get a chance compare the two there is no comparison! The 204 using Remington Acrotips are humane I've never not picked one up had em travell a few yards but I don't know how when you see the state of them the 204 round has blown them apart so how far will the one go if shot with a 17hmr ? Now 17 centre fire is a different story been out with my mate and his and that does drop Charlie Still doesn't hit as hard as the 204 though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorg Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 Had just this conversation with my feo last week, What the police do not want is people out lamping on the back of a vehicle with 17hmrs poping at 200yd plus foxes . We have all shot foxes with a 17hmr, but if you were out for a nights foxing would you really pick up a 17 as your rifle of choice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaz6br Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 Had just this conversation with my feo last week, What the police do not want is people out lamping on the back of a vehicle with 17hmrs poping at 200yd plus foxes . We have all shot foxes with a 17hmr, but if you were out for a nights foxing would you really pick up a 17 as your rifle of choice? Spot on, no you wouldn't take a hmr for a nights foxing. I'd take my 22 lr (joke) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbal Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 Had just this conversation with my feo last week, What the police do not want is people out lamping on the back of a vehicle with 17hmrs poping at 200yd plus foxes . We have all shot foxes with a 17hmr, but if you were out for a nights foxing would you really pick up a 17 as your rifle of choice? The problem ' comes from those who have no choice of rifle,or are ignorant, or both.It has not been helped by those who should have known better,but claim(ed) the 17HMR was fox capable.That said,there might well be issues with those shooters riding around on the back of a pick up 'having a pop' at foxes with any cartridge.The police view seems sound. Gbal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorg Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 I feel for the police on this, they cannot differenctate on this between popping the odd fox of in a close up situation and long range vermin control, its either fox legal or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbal Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 I feel for the police on this, they cannot differenctate on this between popping the odd fox of in a close up situation and long range vermin control, its either fox legal or not. Quite so.Perhaps someone will come up with a feasible/realistic way to deal with this sort of issue-and join the police and do it. Common sense cannot be relied on,nor legislated,so we have some discretion,as the option offering the least damage to the least number of shooters,if not foxes. Gbal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montey Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 I use a 17Hmr on rabbits all the time and its a great stopper I also shoot a Howa 204 for long range rabbits and fox I would never use the 17Hmr on fox. The 32g and 40g Rem Acrotips really hit hard and I've never not had a fox travel more than a few yards after being shot with the 204.We all owe it to the fox to use a proper stopper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montey Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 I use a 17Hmr on rabbits all the time and its a great stopper I also shoot a Howa 204 for long range rabbits and fox I would never use the 17Hmr on fox. The 32g and 40g Rem Acrotips really hit hard and I've never not had a fox travel more than a few yards after being shot with the 204.We all owe it to the fox to use a proper stopper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon6ppc Posted July 13, 2013 Report Share Posted July 13, 2013 i would not use a hmr for fox,think we all know it will kill a fox but me my self i would rather shoot some thing with to much over kill than the other,in my younger hunting days it may be would,nt of botherd me but i think those who want to have the best humane kill as possible should use at least an hornet as we know even with a centerfire rifle a fox can be hard work at times ,just my opinion,cheers simon.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbal Posted July 13, 2013 Report Share Posted July 13, 2013 i would not use a hmr for fox,think we all know it will kill a fox but me my self i would rather shoot some thing with to much over kill than the other,in my younger hunting days it may be would,nt of botherd me but i think those who want to have the best humane kill as possible should use at least an hornet as we know even with a centerfire rifle a fox can be hard work at times ,just my opinion,cheers simon.... Absolutely-I'd prefer a Hornet on steroids...incidentally,the "6PPC on steroids" is the 6.5 Grendell,an 'improved 'ppc design.The 6BR is a vertically challenged 243 ! All excellent cartridges, of course. Gbal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
22/250 foxer Posted July 13, 2013 Report Share Posted July 13, 2013 ive shot a good number of foxes when i had hmr. i didn't go out looking for them. it was well out shooting rabbits etc. if i come across a fox and he was in a range that wasn't deemed to much for the little 17 i would shoot them. all about keeping the range down and picking the right shot. i sort of blame the police. years ago the would grant you hmr for fox. now they know its not ideal they have stopped it in most force areas. also i think there idea behind it was well let him have fox on hmr. then he wont need to ask for a cf rifle for foxes just yet. they kind of made a rod for there own backs. you guys are right though there are much better calibres out there for foxing. as a all round rifle to do rabbits and foxing there isn't really one imo. people say hornet. yes there cheap to reload etc and offer more then enough power. trouble is if you shoot lots and lots of rabbits reloading all the time becomes a pisser imo when you can buy cheap factory rimmy ammo. we all know when a shot shouldn't be taken on foxes with a rimfire. sometimes if your in the jeep its just ideal to carry your cf in back encase mr fox does pass you on your travels. of course people who walk there permissions wouldn't want to carry all that gear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon6ppc Posted July 13, 2013 Report Share Posted July 13, 2013 ive shot a good number of foxes when i had hmr. i didn't go out looking for them. it was well out shooting rabbits etc. if i come across a fox and he was in a range that wasn't deemed to much for the little 17 i would shoot them. all about keeping the range down and picking the right shot. i sort of blame the police. years ago the would grant you hmr for fox. now they know its not ideal they have stopped it in most force areas. also i think there idea behind it was well let him have fox on hmr. then he wont need to ask for a cf rifle for foxes just yet. they kind of made a rod for there own backs. you guys are right though there are much better calibres out there for foxing. as a all round rifle to do rabbits and foxing there isn't really one imo. people say hornet. yes there cheap to reload etc and offer more then enough power. trouble is if you shoot lots and lots of rabbits reloading all the time becomes a pisser imo when you can buy cheap factory rimmy ammo. we all know when a shot shouldn't be taken on foxes with a rimfire. sometimes if your in the jeep its just ideal to carry your cf in back encase mr fox does pass you on your travels. of course people who walk there permissions wouldn't want to carry all that gear i agree pal i think when most foxes get shot with a HMR its when they are rabbiting and one just shows up out the blue,i think in the right hands as it is,nt illegal may be ime 50,50 about it,but every one to there own, cheers simon... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
204 rem Posted July 21, 2013 Report Share Posted July 21, 2013 what are everyones thoughts on this trying to get a perspective as i read some people use them and some people dont i have seem videos of people taking down a fox with a .17HMR with a body shot what are the laws and what are the guidelines? thanks in advance everyones views and opinions are welcome . I had a 17 HMR for many years when first starting out I have lost count of the number of foxes I have shot with the hmr I have never body shoted a fox I always aim for the head I have taken foxes well over 100 yards The more practice you get the better shot you will be I now shot foxes with my 204 & hornet much better Rifles for Foxing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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