1066 Posted August 25, 2017 Report Share Posted August 25, 2017 Richard, yes that's exactly the type of discipline that I would like to do (Open class or FTR) and level to get to also, with a lot of effort and good equipment. Open F and FTR are really quite different animals. FTR is only .223 or .308 and a .308 won't really be competitive in Open F class. As previously said, you really need to give it a try and find out what's involved before you decide which way to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalua Posted August 25, 2017 Report Share Posted August 25, 2017 Target rifle (TR) shot with iron sights and a sling, and F class, either Open or FTR, would be the easiest to get into with more opportunities, ie ranges and clubs involved with advice on equipment and technique. You could spend as little as £400.00 on a very second hand target rifle and pick up the various other bits like spotting scope, jacket, sling and glove for another hundred quid or so for TR, whereas F class maybe £1500 would get you a second hand rifle and scope with bipod or rest for a few hundred quid more. I think this sounds sensible, assuming your eyes and arms are up to elbows and iron sights. Why do I think so? About 5 years ago, after a long while spent using rifles in the field, I joined a club as a just to access zeroing/load-testing ranges nearish home. Club-folk seemed keen that I should have a go at a competition - so I did. I shot an F/TR match with a No4-actioned 7.62 target-rifle from the 1970's, fitted with a Leupold 'scope. The rifle cost £275 with 'scope-mount and (importantly) its original iron TR sights. I worked up a load using 147gr S&B FMJs and a modest amount of TR140 (cheapskate, you see) Having quickly established that this was not a competitive combo for F/TR and not wishing to overextend myself financially I resigned myself to using it and doing as well as I could with the basics of hold, trigger and wind-reading. After a bit I stuck the iron sights back on, took the old Harris off and started to shoot TR instead. More learning followed, as did gradual acquisition of a spotting scope with stand, a smallbore TR-jacket, a big l/h glove - total cost for that lot did not exceed £100. When I wasn't getting any better, I bought a Swing Mk4 and worked up a proper load with a proper bullet. Remarkable change in performance - which I was in a good position to make use of. I am certainly not suggesting that I am any good at TR, nor that a Swing Mk4 is the experts' target-rifle, but my scores are not usually an embarrassment, and I feel that actually having to hold the rifle gives the otherwise rather niche activity of TR shooting some relevance to the other kinds of rifle-shooting which I enjoy. Both rifles and the other bits came to under £1500, and I still use the No4-actioned rifle for things like McQueens - which I don't win either, of course - but that ain't the point! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JKenny Posted August 25, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2017 Open F and FTR are really quite different animals. FTR is only .223 or .308 and a .308 won't really be competitive in Open F class. As previously said, you really need to give it a try and find out what's involved before you decide which way to go. 1066 I think your right having looked at it again in more detail. I am currently trying to get a hold of my local club that supports these disciplines but currently getting nothing back which is a tad annoying considering I would like to go asap and find out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1066 Posted August 25, 2017 Report Share Posted August 25, 2017 1066 I think your right having looked at it again in more detail. I am currently trying to get a hold of my local club that supports these disciplines but currently getting nothing back which is a tad annoying considering I would like to go asap and find out. It could be expensive to get it wrong - I would suggest £5k would get your to the starting line in F-open. £3k for a rifle, £1k for a scope and £1k for front rest, rear bag, odds and ends - You could easily spend double with very little effort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leeman Posted August 25, 2017 Report Share Posted August 25, 2017 1066 I think your right having looked at it again in more detail. I am currently trying to get a hold of my local club that supports these disciplines but currently getting nothing back which is a tad annoying considering I would like to go asap and find out. John, I don't know how far your location is from Pitlochry but the West Atoll Club would be the one I would be looking at, have you seen their website? There is a member here that goes by the name of Desperado, he is a member there and a bit of an F class guru, he should be back from Canada by now, unless he's travelling by canoe, having competed at the world F class championship. Richard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JKenny Posted August 28, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 28, 2017 John, I don't know how far your location is from Pitlochry but the West Atoll Club would be the one I would be looking at, have you seen their website? There is a member here that goes by the name of Desperado, he is a member there and a bit of an F class guru, he should be back from Canada by now, unless he's travelling by canoe, having competed at the world F class championship. Richard. I am based in Stirlingshire region nearer falkirk, I have had a look at these website it's very impressive but to far away from me I am afraid i may still take a run up on a day they have a competition or posibly arrange to speak to them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laurie Posted August 28, 2017 Report Share Posted August 28, 2017 I am based in Stirlingshire region nearer falkirk, I have had a look at these website it's very impressive but to far away from me I am afraid i may still take a run up on a day they have a competition or posibly arrange to speak to them If that's too far away, forget any dreams of competing at national / international level in F-Class / FTR. The primary (in fact sole ranges) are Glen Tilt (Blair Atholl), MoD Barry Buddon in Tayside (little used for high level civilian competition these days I believe because of military and environmental constraints); Diggle near Manchester; Altcar on the Lancashire coast north of Liverpool (another military range with constraints); and of course Bisley. National teams spend more time practising at Bisley than anywhere else and the two GB F-Class teams for the just completed F-Class 'Worlds' in Canada saw a fair number of Scottish shooters making regular treks down to Surrey. If you're serious about F-Class, you'll find more top practitioners of the discipline at Blair Atholl than anywhere else in Scotland with a number of highly experienced people who shoot there living in the central belt and East Lothian. The primary reason is that high-level F is shot over long distances, 800/900/1,000 yards and WARC at Glen Tilt is the only civilian club in Scotland offering this facility for marked targets. It is also the home of 'Match Rifle' in Scotland another discipline that meets your criteria, but which is shot with 308 Win rifles over 1,000/1,100/1,200 yards in the UK, the only other UK venue being Bisley. With the F-Class 'Worlds' over, the next national + international event is the annual European Championship event at Bisley over 25th September to 1st October for which the many Scottish entrants will not make the longest trips, some coming from Finland, Ukraine and Russia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JKenny Posted August 28, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 28, 2017 If that's too far away, forget any dreams of competing at national / international level in F-Class / FTR. The primary (in fact sole ranges) are Glen Tilt (Blair Atholl), MoD Barry Buddon in Tayside (little used for high level civilian competition these days I believe because of military and environmental constraints); Diggle near Manchester; Altcar on the Lancashire coast north of Liverpool (another military range with constraints); and of course Bisley. National teams spend more time practising at Bisley than anywhere else and the two GB F-Class teams for the just completed F-Class 'Worlds' in Canada saw a fair number of Scottish shooters making regular treks down to Surrey. If you're serious about F-Class, you'll find more top practitioners of the discipline at Blair Atholl than anywhere else in Scotland with a number of highly experienced people who shoot there living in the central belt and East Lothian. The primary reason is that high-level F is shot over long distances, 800/900/1,000 yards and WARC at Glen Tilt is the only civilian club in Scotland offering this facility for marked targets. It is also the home of 'Match Rifle' in Scotland another discipline that meets your criteria, but which is shot with 308 Win rifles over 1,000/1,100/1,200 yards in the UK, the only other UK venue being Bisley. With the F-Class 'Worlds' over, the next national + international event is the annual European Championship event at Bisley over 25th September to 1st October for which the many Scottish entrants will not make the longest trips, some coming from Finland, Ukraine and Russia. Hi Laurie, thanks for the response so in your opinion to get in to competition level target shooting F-Class etc, my best bet would be to head up to Pitlochry and join West Atholl? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laurie Posted August 28, 2017 Report Share Posted August 28, 2017 Hi Laurie, thanks for the response so in your opinion to get in to competition level target shooting F-Class etc, my best bet would be to head up to Pitlochry and join West Atholl? I'd certainly recommend contacting the club to ascertain the dates of long-range F matches and to get its agreement to your paying a visit to see if you like the idea of the discipline and talk to some of the very competent and knowledgeable people who take part up there. (It is a fantastic place too - a visit is a must-do if there is a rifle shooter's equivalent to a '100 things to do before I die' list. Just remember to take midge repellent if the wind forecast is for less than 5 mph breezes.) Also, before doing that, (as previously suggested by 'Leeman' a couple of posts back) you really do need to PM Des Parr (Desperado on this forum) a top Scottish F-Class ('Open' class in his case) competitor who is a power in the land (or at any rate in the GB F-Class Association) and one of the earliest GB 'Effers' playing a major role in creating the discipline in this country and setting up its UK governing body the GB FCA. Des resides in Livingston IIRC and will be a mine of useful information and advice on getting into the discipline and Scottish ranges / clubs that you might be able to use. If you have too few posts 'in' to send a PM, say so and I'll PM you Des's email address. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grum87 Posted August 28, 2017 Report Share Posted August 28, 2017 It is an excellent range, if a bit of a trek for some. You'll find many members up there are also members at Fife and Kinross, who shoot at Blairadam(just off the motorway by Kelty). Blairadam isn't far for you, its a 20-25 minute 'lively' scoot through the glen for me from where I am. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JKenny Posted August 28, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 28, 2017 I'd certainly recommend contacting the club to ascertain the dates of long-range F matches and to get its agreement to your paying a visit to see if you like the idea of the discipline and talk to some of the very competent and knowledgeable people who take part up there. (It is a fantastic place too - a visit is a must-do if there is a rifle shooter's equivalent to a '100 things to do before I die' list. Just remember to take midge repellent if the wind forecast is for less than 5 mph breezes.) Also, before doing that, (as previously suggested by 'Leeman' a couple of posts back) you really do need to PM Des Parr (Desperado on this forum) a top Scottish F-Class ('Open' class in his case) competitor who is a power in the land (or at any rate in the GB F-Class Association) and one of the earliest GB 'Effers' playing a major role in creating the discipline in this country and setting up its UK governing body the GB FCA. Des resides in Livingston IIRC and will be a mine of useful information and advice on getting into the discipline and Scottish ranges / clubs that you might be able to use. If you have too few posts 'in' to send a PM, say so and I'll PM you Des's email address. Hi Richard it won't allow me could you possibly kindly do that for me please and let me email him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JKenny Posted August 28, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 28, 2017 I'd certainly recommend contacting the club to ascertain the dates of long-range F matches and to get its agreement to your paying a visit to see if you like the idea of the discipline and talk to some of the very competent and knowledgeable people who take part up there. (It is a fantastic place too - a visit is a must-do if there is a rifle shooter's equivalent to a '100 things to do before I die' list. Just remember to take midge repellent if the wind forecast is for less than 5 mph breezes.) Also, before doing that, (as previously suggested by 'Leeman' a couple of posts back) you really do need to PM Des Parr (Desperado on this forum) a top Scottish F-Class ('Open' class in his case) competitor who is a power in the land (or at any rate in the GB F-Class Association) and one of the earliest GB 'Effers' playing a major role in creating the discipline in this country and setting up its UK governing body the GB FCA. Des resides in Livingston IIRC and will be a mine of useful information and advice on getting into the discipline and Scottish ranges / clubs that you might be able to use. If you have too few posts 'in' to send a PM, say so and I'll PM you Des's email address. Hi Richard it won't allow me could you possibly kindly do that for me please and let me email him. It is an excellent range, if a bit of a trek for some. You'll find many members up there are also members at Fife and Kinross, who shoot at Blairadam(just off the motorway by Kelty). Blairadam isn't far for you, its a 20-25 minute 'lively' scoot through the glen for me from where I am. That's not far at all to be fair i don't mind travelling bit it's like well where do I start where do I go how much do I spend etc etc ad knowing wether to go full pelt head in to it or take it slow and take it in Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grum87 Posted August 29, 2017 Report Share Posted August 29, 2017 If nothing else, Fife and Kinross are much closer, and it will let you see whether you enjoy this style of target shooting or not. I'm sure you could organise a visit to them on one of their shoots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desparado Posted August 30, 2017 Report Share Posted August 30, 2017 Laurie, (and John), Thanks for the effusive praise and compliments etc - the £5 is in the post. John contacted me by email and I have pointed him in the direction of Fife & Kinross in the first instance, being a bit closer. I'm sure Paul Crosbie and Paul Sandie (the new 2nd in the World) will take good care of him. Hopefully, John will find which discipline seems to suit him best. Cheers, Des. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTO Posted September 20, 2017 Report Share Posted September 20, 2017 Unless you stick to F/TR, another expense is up to £1 a round in barrel wear if you chase velocity. .284W can be a bit cheaper, though. Plenty of info within other threads on this subject. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gruntus Posted November 16, 2017 Report Share Posted November 16, 2017 Hi JKenny, In terms of clubs I'm a member of the civil service club in Fife (and no you dont need to be a civil servant to be a member). We shoot at Blairadam (just north of Kelty) each month (distances vary throughout the year from 100 to 500 yards but typically 200 yards). We have a 308club rifle which can be used and membership also allows . 22 shooting each Friday in Dunfermline and gallery 25m shooting of lever actions at Craigluscar as well. Ping mean IM if you need more info as I'm a member of other clubs as well. All the best G Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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