tipped match kings

[1967spud]

they can be posted

[bewsh]

can I ask are you allowed on your ticket to shoot vermin with a centre fire because I cant unless stated on ticket if you can great im jealous I can only use my c fire for fox

 

Dave this is simply not correct and is a misconception that FLO's are allowing to spread through ignorance

If you choose to shoot a crow with your .223 that you have acquired with the "good reason" of "FOX" control you are not in breach of any conditions any more than I am if I shoot one with a rifle conditioned for 1D deer (even though that has now been abolished up here!)

 

if you were to habitually do it and stop shooting foxes then your use would not match your primary reason

 

the main reason you have a "fox" condition is the distinction between a deer legal calibre conditioned for deer or one conditioned for fox

 

to make it easier you should request either an AOLQ condition or add vermin to that current condition.

 

use the HO guidance as your reference

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/417199/Guidance_on_Firearms_Licensing_Law_v13.pdf

 

 

Conditions attached by chief officers of police

10.35 Section 27(2) of the 1968 Act gives the chief officer of police powers to attach conditions to firearm certificates where necessary. In the case of 'R v Wakefield Crown Court ex parte Oldfield (1978)' the court gave expression to the common law requirement that a person must exercise individual judgement in all cases. Section 29(1) of the 1968 Act gives the chief officer power to vary, by a notice in writing, any such condition not prescribed by the rules made by the Secretary of State. The notice may require the holder to deliver the certificate to the chief officer within twenty-one days for the purpose of amending the conditions. The certificate may be revoked if the holder fails to comply with such a requirement.

 

10.36 Possible conditions, which may be applied are listed at Appendix 3 as a guide to firearms licensing officers. They should only be used, where the individual circumstances require it for public safety. Exceptionally, chief officers of police may impose other conditions appropriate to individual circumstances. As the courts have held ('R v Cambridge Crown Court ex parte Buckland, 1998') that there is no right of appeal against the imposition of conditions (as opposed to a refusal to grant or renew a certificate) chief officers will wish to be cautious in imposing conditions that might amount to a constructive refusal to grant or renew a certificate, that is, additional conditions that would make possession or use so difficult as to be redundant in practice. There is a right of appeal against a decision to vary existing conditions in section 29, but not against the initial decision to impose conditions.

 

10.37 Every effort must be made to limit the number of additional conditions imposed on a firearm certificate and ensure that they are not contradictory. Care should be taken, however, to ensure that all ‘good reasons’ for which a firearm is possessed are allowed for, for instance stalking and target shooting.

 

10.38 There is no requirement to establish ‘good reason’ for additional conditions or the addition of quarry species to an existing condition where ‘good reason’ already exists for the possession of a firearm in the first instance (See chapter 13). Firearms should be conditioned to provide flexibility with quarry shooting by allowing all lawful quarry (see Appendix 3).

 

10.39 Conditions setting out arbitrary time limits for acquiring firearms and ammunition should not be imposed. However, the chief officer may during the life of a certificate or at the time of certificate renewal enquire why an authority to acquire has not been exercised and consider that part of the renewal in the light of the reason given. It should be borne in mind that a collector may face difficulty in finding examples of collectible or heritage firearms suitable for their collections and that a time limit should not apply where reasonable attempts to procure the firearm(s) concerned are being or have been made. 79 Guide on Firearms Licensing Law

 

10.40 Chief officers of police are empowered to impose conditions if they think that the circumstances of the individual case mean that the condition is necessary to ensure the effective operation of the firearms controls and to minimise the risk to public safety. Forces should note that those conditions relating to otherwise prohibited firearms and ammunition such as expanding ammunition are statutory. The chief officer does not have discretion to grant a certificate for such firearms and ammunition beyond the terms of the statutory exemptions for these items.

[Barrelsniffer]

can I ask are you allowed on your ticket to shoot vermin with a centre fire because I cant unless stated on ticket if you can great im jealous I can only use my c fire for fox

 

Dave,

 

Give cheshire a call i now have any other lawful quarry on my rifles i.e. CF, had it since my last renewal now about 2 yrs, so yes cheshire will now allow it.

 

Mick

[froggy]

Apologies Stephentri

 

Your original post has taken a different direction, but just like any other group of blokes having a pint and a chat at the bar, the topic of conversation will often change like the weather. This is why I enjoy reading this forum.

 

Any one who is not conditioned for AOLQ and who thinks they may find the need of this condition in the future should, in my opinion, request this condition on their FAC. A comprehensive list of licensing authorities could then be obtained from members already granted this condition and provided to members who are not aware or struggling to obtain this agreed facility.

 

A singular request to their licencing authority may, for the applicant, feel like they are rocking the boat, but they may find that they are not being treated fairly if refused, and that others have already been granted AOLQ what they are requesting in their area.

 

Admin.

 

As a suggestion would you consider a thread containing a list of licencing authoriteis already granting AOLQ to members of this forum, to assist any members in obtaining this AOLQ condition?

 

I am happy to state that I have AOLQ with Dyfed Powys Police

 

cheers

 

Froggy

[Montey]

Thanks Spud ill be ordering some soon as anything made by Hornady seems to be veering in quality.

[Akeld]

Thanks Spud ill be ordering some soon as anything made by Hornady seems to be veering in quality.

 

And the intermitent supply, part of the reason I've switched from both Hornady and Hodgdon

[dave thorniley]

higuys thxs for all your kind info got intouch with my f arms licensing dept and explained my situation and they told me to send my ticket in to them which I did fingers crossed cheers dave.

[dave thorniley]

thxs froggy micky bewsh and big al regards dave.

[AnthonyR]

Back to the original question.

 

I have now worked up a load with the 77gr TMK in my fast twist 22-250, which incidentally are far more accurate than the 75gr A-Max I was going to use in this rifle and I shot a couple pigeons at over 200 yards last night, both were completely blown to bits like they were shot with normal ballistic tipped hunting ammo, not scientific I know and more work still to do but it looks like this will be my go to bullet for this rifle.

[stephentri]

Back to the original question.

 

I have now worked up a load with the 77gr TMK in my fast twist 22-250, which incidentally are far more accurate than the 75gr A-Max I was going to use in this rifle and I shot a couple pigeons at over 200 yards last night, both were completely blown to bits like they were shot with normal ballistic tipped hunting ammo, not scientific I know and more work still to do but it looks like this will be my go to bullet for this rifle.

Thanks for that info

[dave thorniley]

hi sorry stephentri I didn't mean to hijack your conversation it is a good topic cheers good shooting dave.

[capreolus]

Gents,

My opion only, but the most influential factor regarding terminal effect on small fragile quarry like crows and pigieons and a like is not bullet contruction/performance but velocity. As I am sure you are all aware any centerfire rifle which would be deemed to be acceptable for this purpose (at longer ranges) will be sending a projectile at over 3000fps and alot more in most cases, and it is this that causes the violent reaction to the target, Bullets will cause a perminant wound channel ie the path of the bullet but alot more damage is caused by the temporary cavity that is produced by the shockwave of the bullet passing through the target especially if its a very fragile target like a bird. Using fragile bullets that are designed to expand violently is a benifit but on a bird which only measures around 3" thick by the time the bullet has started to expand it has exited. Small quarry like birds do not have the structural strength to contain the shock wave / temporary cavity which is why they will sometines apear to detonate on impact.

There is a big benifit however in using these fragile bullets and that would be safety. When the bullet expands and breaks up it is disapating its energy very quickly and reduces the risk of an unwanted richocet into an unknown place. Using high BC target projectiles is attractive because of there balistic performance but we do need to keep fresh in our minds the most important factor of safety. Sorry to preach to the converted!

[stephentri]

hi sorry stephentri I didn't mean to hijack your conversation it is a good topic cheers good shooting dave.

It's fine every bit of info is useful ☺

[tackb]

Back to the original question.

 

I have now worked up a load with the 77gr TMK in my fast twist 22-250, which incidentally are far more accurate than the 75gr A-Max I was going to use in this rifle and I shot a couple pigeons at over 200 yards last night, both were completely blown to bits like they were shot with normal ballistic tipped hunting ammo, not scientific I know and more work still to do but it looks like this will be my go to bullet for this rifle.

 

is it as long as the amax ? I'm hoping it may mag feed from my sako A1?

[Bangbangman]

is it as long as the amax ? I'm hoping it may mag feed from my sako A1?

The 77TMK is approx 0.0265" shorter (base to tip) than 75gr Amax.

 

However, it can be loaded to shorter OAL length due to the different ogive. Eg: I can load the TMK to AR mag length (and it will feed) of 2.260" OAL. If I load the Amax to this length the ogive is inside the neck of the case!

 

I don't know what your Sako will accept as OAL and still feed, but the TMK should work if the 75gr Amax does. NB. Reduced case capacity at this length.

[tackb]

The 77TMK is approx 0.0265" shorter than 75gr Amax.

However, it can be loaded to shorter OAL length due to the different ogive. Eg: I can load the TMK to AR mag length (and it will feed) of 2.260" OAL. If I load the Amax to this length. The ogive is inside the neck of the case!

I don't know what your Sako will accept as OAL and still feed, but the TMK should work if the 75gr Amax does. NB. Reduced case capacity at this length.

Right , I'm getting some !

[dave thorniley]

hi just to let you guys know I got my ticket changed to aolq many thxs for your information cheers dave.

[andybrock]

hi just to let you guys know I got my ticket changed to aolq many thxs for your information cheers dave.

:)

[Murph]

My brother shot a fox yesterday evening square in the chest facing on and there wasn't even a exit wound. All the energy had been dumped into the fox. Dead before it knew it. This was the first fox shot with the 69s. I would have no qualms in using it for foxes again. Very hard hitting.

[gaz6br]

Amax state there fine on vermin and thin skinned game I've shot hundreds never recall a problem really

 

Gaz

[1967spud]

sierra now in stock at 1967spud

[bradders]

sierra now in stock at 1967spud

77's?

[MrCetrizine]

125gn .308?

[1967spud]

77's?

 

 

mark

 

only 2 x 500

4 x 100 left

[1967spud]

77's?

 

 

mark

 

only 2 x 500

4

 

125gn .308?

 

 

 

only 5 x 100 left

x 100 left